Dotted lines being cut on CO2 laser

Hello,
we have a Chinese 80W CO2 laser with a Ruida RDC5121 controller. We have been using Lightburn for some time now with v1.3.01. Every now and then parts fail to fall out and we find that sections of the object are cut as a series of dots rather than a line. The latest issue was while cutting acrylic shapes and some failed to drop. The strange thing only noticed this time is that the frequency of the dots on the X axis is about twice that on the Y axis. When cutting as square, the speed of each axis can be seen to be the same. perforation and dot modes are disabled.
Can you help me here please or suggest where I can start?

thanks
Dave

You wouldn’t happen to have perforation mode selected?

No. Perforation and Dot are both turned off. my thinking is that if either were on, the dots frequency would be the same on both axis?

Perhaps Tabs? Teeny weeny tabs, tabs everywhere? :grin:

That seems unlikely.

Verify that the laser PWM is still set to 20 kHz: Edit → Machine Settings → Vendor Settings → Laser Settings → Laser 1 Frequency. There is no way that should change, particularly just occasionally, but it’s easy to rule out.

Similarly, the layer settings have a PWM override, but it would take a concatenation of unlikely finger fumbles to both activate and change it; you would have noticed when you verified that Dot Mode was turned off.

Absent all that, you’re probably looking at a failing power supply or (shudder) a failing tube. The fact that the beam cuts differently along the X and Y axes suggests the beam is no longer circular; it might be longer in the Y direction and blurs the dots together.

Compared to tubes, power supplies are (relatively) cheap and readily available, so swapping in a known-good replacement would be a quick-n-easy check that it’s not sending Morse code to the tube. A bad supply would not cause the X vs. Y variation, however.

Check the tube’s lasing mode. Put a paper target at the first mirror and fire a 50% pulse that’s short enough to scorch but not punch through; you should see a nice round spot with a darker center.

Recent pix and discussion of lasing mode (and other stuff):

This may be one of those simple problems with a spendy solution …

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Hello, thanks for the reply. i can answer some questions now.
The PWM frequency is set to 20Khz. There is no PWM offset set. I understand the possibility of a failing power supply but cannot understand how that could change from axis to axis. if you look at the initial photo, you will see how regularly the dot frequency changes as the line changes from axis to axis and back again. i think your idea of the tubes lasing mode being off. i will do as you say and check for a round beam at mirror one. I cannot do this check for a couple of days as the laser is not at my home. to save time, if i find the beam is ok at mirror one (Hopefully!!), what further checks can i do while I am with the laser?
One thing I found odd in the settings is the X and Y step length is VERY different. The X setting is 6.3(um) where as the Y setting is 12.6(um). The calibration has not been checked for a while but it does cut round circles and they are very very close to the measurement in Lightburn. Could this have a bearing on the problem?

Hard agree!

However, weird things can happen, so keep the notion in mind after everything else gets ruled out.

Given that it works, I don’t see the beam splashing off the inside of the optics and changing its shape, particularly because that wouldn’t produce any dots. Combine it with a dotty power supply and maybe you’ve got something, but it’d take some convincing.

A quick beam alignment test to burn spots in targets at the X and Y mirrors, done at the four corners of the platform, would confirm that’s not the problem if all the spots are pretty much in the middle of the apertures.

If the spots aren’t nice and round, though: Bad Sign™.

That’s … odd.

Perhaps the Y axis has a motor pulley twice the diameter of the X axis, for reasons that surely made sense at the time. That would mean one step of the Y motor drives the laser head twice as far as one step on the X motor.

With all the mechanical bits being equal, perhaps the two stepper drivers have different pulse/rev settings, again for a reason lost in the mists of time. If the X driver has 8000 pulse/rev and the Y driver has 4000 pulse/rev, then the Y axis would move twice as far per step.

Neither of those would matter, because the controller knows how many steps it must send to move a specific distance. The two axes would have different speed and acceleration settings, but they would anyway because the Y axis must sling that big gantry around. If you were fussy about tuning, the motor speeds might make a difference, but these lasers aren’t running near their outer performance limits.

Just for completeness, stick your head inside and see if either of those guesses are right.

Not that I wish you any ill, but if it’s not the tube going bad, you’ve definitely got a puzzle on your hands. :smile:

Having had a night to think it over (*), a few more ideas:

Run those rounded rectangles at speeds increasing by a factor of two, starting at whatever you use for normal cutting, something like 5 10 25 50 100 200 400. As long as the laser marks the surface, that’s all you need. If the dot spacing increases by similar factors, then the tube is oscillating / pulsing independently of the mechanics.

Similarly, burn a few circles of ample diameter and see where / if the dots merge into lines. That could show how the not-circular beam is oriented with respect to the optics.

Peek inside the machine at the tube while it’s running. If the discharge along its length is flickering / wobbulating, that’s definitely a Bad Sign™.

(*) I’ll get you for this!

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“It used to work, now doesn’t.” I had this happen to me just recently, and for me, on a 100 Watt unit, it was caused by me forgetting to clean the lens. The dots puzzled me as well. Once I slapped myself on the forehead, and cleaned the very dirty lens, it worked again. May not be your situation… but …

Verily: One careful measurement outweighs a kilo-opinion.

If that solves the current problem, it’s a major win!

Hello,

Thanks very much for the information and sorry for taking your valuable sleep time!

The laser is in a position where it is difficult to pull out and get to the tube to do the first ‘round beam’ test. After the first mirror, the laser passes through a cut-out in a panel so I put a piece of tape across this. The laser burnt the hole pretty quickly but this looks ok to me.



I did a test cut at the original settings of 15/80

I tried a cut at a lower speed and power of 7/40. There were no dots and the part fell out perfectly.
Figuring the power supply could be cutting out at higher outputs, I did a test at 15/100 and the dots were worse.

After several more tests at lower powers and speeds, the dots reappeared and parts stopped falling out. I assume the power supply was getting warmer and failing earlier. At this point, i decided that i would replace the power supply before doing any more burn tests. my attention then turned to the odd step length settings. the Y driver was set to 3200PP rev and the X driver was set to 6400 PP rev. The motor pulleys were found to be the same on X and Y so i reset the Y driver to 6400 and recalibrated both axis. the final figure on both was 6.352395.
Since this point, i have been unable to recreate ANY dotting on either axis and parts are falling out perfectly.
This circle was cut out of 3mm acrylic and the very slight marks on the side were completely consistent all the way around.

.

I am still not fully convinced that the power supply is not cutting out intermittently and if the problem reoccurs i will replace the power supply.
Thanks very much for your help on this issue, i hope that is the end of it!

If I do have to replace the power supply, I assume an 80/100W unit would be preferable to an 80W unit, working more within its limits?

Loving the word ‘Wobbulating’ !!
Best regards

Me thinks your tube is going south… It needs to be TEM0 resonance to function properly…

I’d suggest a 10% larger lps than the tube. I think it give you and edge in response time… but it’s just my opinion.

Good luck

:smiley_cat:

Sorry, can you explain TEMO resonance please?
thanks

I’m with @jkwilborn on this: that first burn doesn’t look right. It should be darker in the middle, not a ring around an unburned center.

The subject of laser resonance modes came up a while ago:

The pix show other failing tubes; yours looks like a candidate to become a wall hanging.

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